tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post116360566341505710..comments2023-10-19T06:11:54.243-04:00Comments on Conservative Beach Girl: America being devoured by its ownBeach Girlhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05210025685265415598noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163672914769763422006-11-16T05:28:00.000-05:002006-11-16T05:28:00.000-05:00Cachorro Quente.Thank you for your comment. I am ...Cachorro Quente.<BR/>Thank you for your comment. I am well grounded in the history of the founding of my nation. I have long affiliation with the Masons, as my father was a Mason for 57 years. I know well that the Free Masons of Britian had a great hand in the founding of the nation. Mr. Jefferson was the Founder who wrote the Declaration of the Freedom of Religions because at the time of our founding, many states had "state" churches. <BR/><BR/>Actually, Mr. Jefferson and General Washington had family pews (booths) next to each other in Bruton Parish Church in Williamsburg, Virginia. I have sat in Mr. Jefferson's family's booth.<BR/><BR/>But it would be incorrect to say that the Founders all started with the ideal of separation of church and state. That was Mr. Jefferson's vision and an accurate one but he was vehement about the separation of church and state for one special reason many may not know - in his day, people paid a "poll" tax so to speak to support the state religion, this tax was levied against all citizens whether they attended the state church or not. It is this that was seen as totally against our values of equality and fairness. Mr. Jefferson would be vehemently opposed to the "dhimmi" tax placed on non-Muslims in Islamic nations as an example.<BR/><BR/>And no, our Founders were not all that thrilled about the French Revolution in light of the attrocities what accompanied it. As you know, Mr. Jefferson was in Paris when the revolution began and he, according to biographers, was pleased with it stating that a good cleansing was a healthy thing from time to time. That it devolved into a dictatorship proved, to me, that the French at that time had not captured the intent of our democratic republic. <BR/><BR/>Our founders did not share the up-coming ideologies of the French Revolution (1789) - it was the French who shared our ideals (1776) - they just took matters to the extreme, the mob ruled which is not the goal of a representative republic, and they executed Louis XVI who was the best support the fledgling new nation had - of course this because he would do anything to trounce the British.<BR/><BR/>Yes, Judeo-Christian values cetainly formed the underpinnings of our nation's founding and yes, most, not all, but most of the Founding Fathers were Masons.<BR/><BR/>Church life was an integral part of our founding, however, Mr. Jefferson was against the "established" church of many states in the new union but his reasons have been subscribed to the fact that poorer parishoners had separate churches, not many went to Bruton Parish Church, as an example. At that time in our history, though people of means, landed property owners, and such were of a decidedly "higher" class. Our founders did not wish to continue that class distinction as it was a carry-over from the colonies early times with England. And as I said, Mr. Jefferson was against the "poll" tax paid by all citizens to support an established church they did not follow. Even at that, the established church of the day did not "run" the government.<BR/><BR/>The Judeo-Christian values of which I speak are out-growths of the Ten Commandments, if you will, and the values spill over into our general mores of behavior. It is difficult to separate those mores, the representative democracy (a republic) the Founders created, and the goals of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" as unalienable rights given to all man by his Creator (ie God). Of these "rights' coming from a Creator and not from a government, the Founders were quite clear. These are laws above the government established by man.<BR/><BR/>America is not a democracy and, frankly, very few churches in America are democracies. No, what I am saying is that it is because of the "tolerance" in our nation of other religions and other ideologies that we have the nation we have; to me, it is the Judeo-Christian value of loving thy neighbor as thyself that enables those who wish to destroy our nation to exist; it is a combination of our Constitution and our Judeo-Christian values. <BR/><BR/>There is no denying that many of our laws have followed from our Judeo-Christian values and some of our Founding Fathers were Deists. Our representative republic is the best system derived thus far and it is a master plan created by our best thinkers who seemed to combine or to aspire to the best in men based upon the combination of our Judeo-Christian values and the out-growth of a system of government that goes very far back into much earlier cultures. I think, candidly, our Founders (many of whom were philosophers and self-taught men) took the best they could gather from what is called Western Civilization and forged a great system, which even they said was up to us to keep.<BR/><BR/>America has been called a "grand experiment". It is based on a combination of individual liberty and freedom coupled with the responsibility that accompanies those freedoms and liberty. And none of our Founding Fathers, even Mr. Jefferson's letter to a group of Baptists I think, ever expected God or the mention of God to be driven from the public square.<BR/><BR/>But, a democracy - no, thank God, our Founders knew the horrors a democracy would bring. A true democracy is mob rule and that ends in no freedom.<BR/><BR/>America is still an ideal, Cachorro Quente. It has not yet devolved in the 613(?) laws of Leviticus.Beach Girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05210025685265415598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163665263732134802006-11-16T03:21:00.000-05:002006-11-16T03:21:00.000-05:00Sorry, Beach Girl, but your nation was'nt founded ...Sorry, Beach Girl, but your nation was'nt founded "in Judeo-Christian principles", but by people like Thomas Jefferson (who was accused of being an atheist), by free-masons and open-minded intellectuals which for the first time in history separated Church and State. Many of them shared the same ideals of the upcoming French Revolution. From what you say, it seems that democracy is a peculiarity of the christian culture.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163627197139487312006-11-15T16:46:00.000-05:002006-11-15T16:46:00.000-05:00Steve, I'll try to find your comment. Any hints o...Steve, I'll try to find your comment. Any hints on what post the comments follow? I'll take a closer look at WND.Beach Girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05210025685265415598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163627140547905072006-11-15T16:45:00.000-05:002006-11-15T16:45:00.000-05:00Cachorro Quente, thank you for comments. I'll hav...Cachorro Quente, thank you for comments. I'll have to re-read, didn't mean that far left should have thankfulness to Christians - meant that the Constitution of our nation was founded in Judeo-Christian principles - individual equality before the law. It is that equality before the law that enables the far Left to tear down principles.<BR/><BR/>I tend to agree with you regarding Franco's history. A big thing of mine is when we didn't go into Hungary in the 1950's to help those people.<BR/><BR/>You're comments are welcome any time. I said it rather badly but I was trying to say that those principles are what allow those who may not like what we do to work to eradicate what they don't like. They do not owe Christianity thankfullness - they own our Founding Fathers gratitude for setting up a government that they are free to work to change.<BR/><BR/>Come back any time.Beach Girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05210025685265415598noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163612251426632302006-11-15T12:37:00.000-05:002006-11-15T12:37:00.000-05:00We have the ACLU and the leftists that are running...We have the ACLU and the leftists that are running our schools to thank for this sad turn of events.<BR/>It's a crime against history that's being perpetrated, and not just at the supreme court. Even in our national parks at some of the historic monuments revisionist history is being taught. Our heritage as a nation is slowly being consumed, burned on the altar of political correctness.<BR/>Immigrants wishing to become citizens are required to know more about our history, our laws, and even our culture than students in our schools. Is it any wonder that so many of todays youth think of the United States as an evil aggressor nation that can do no good when this is how we are taught?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30462652.post-1163608990559216782006-11-15T11:43:00.000-05:002006-11-15T11:43:00.000-05:00Sorry, I lost you when you said that Christianity ...Sorry, I lost you when you said that Christianity defends (defended?) the right of the Far Left to exists.<BR/>My family is far-leftist since before WWII, but we did'nt notice. Maybe Christianity is very subtle in difending us far-leftists in order to avoid to overwhelm us with sense of guilt for our un-thankingfulness (?). Maybe too subtle. Where was Christianity in Spain, Italy and Germany during the 30's? Blessing Franco's soldiers before they killed communist activists. Signing convenient pacts with Mussolini. In Germany, only Jeovah's Witnesses opposed Hitler.<BR/>To me, the episode you're referring to it's just standard politically correct bullhsit. Really, much ado about nothing.<BR/>Excuse the English.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com